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Samizdata, derived from Samizdat /n. - a system of clandestine publication of banned literature in the USSR [Russ.,= self-publishing house]

Samizdata quote of the day

World order be damned for a corollary to world government, and I expect the waters of the world are not a problem to police if one returns to the policy of hanging pirates instead of playing catch-and-release.

– Commenter ‘Erik

12 comments to Samizdata quote of the day

  • And proponents of a New World Order intend to be the ones giving the orders.

  • If the USA stops being the world’s policeman, there will not be a “New World Order” but rather a return to a more fragmented multipolar world. There will be both upsides and downsides to that.

  • PhilB

    If you recall the problem with Piracy in the Indian ocean off the coast of Somalia and the Red Sea, the British and Western navies did indeed do a “catch and release” with the pirates and played stupid buggers with them. Finding a 15 foot dinghy with 10 men in it, armed with AK47’s and RPGs 300 miles from the nearest land with enough fuel for 20 miles or so and accepting that they are fishing with no fishing equipment is … a bit silly.

    The Russians sent in their Speznaz troops with a “Kill them all, let their God sort them out” policy and this resulted in a remarkably low rate of reoffending. It also stopped the pirates in their tracks. The Brits on the other hand …

    So from another thread (“This will be Obamas enduring legacy”), if Russia WAS to police the worlds oceans as Britain did in the 19th and early 20th Centuries, then there is likely to be a similar condition of peace and safety for all users of the seas that prevailed during that time.

    Will the west be willing to allow this or is the price paid in pirated ships worth it to grant the pirates their human rights? Answers on the back of a postcard to the usual address.

  • I don’t know. If we castrated them before releasing them, it might have a salutary effect.

  • Nicholas (Unlicensed Joker!) Gray

    PhilB, I was talking about the capacity, or lack thereof, of the Russians to drive the Chinese away from the artificial islands in the South China Seas. And who will stop slavery now? The Muslim nations haven’t really given it up- they think of it as a requirement of their religion, since Mohammed didn’t denounce it, and some quotes suggest enforcing it on nonmuslims as proof of their inferior status in this world and the next.

  • Laird

    I rather like the idea of a “more fragmented multipolar world,” even if there are some downsides to it. Concentrated power is always dangerous even in the best of hands, and it is never in the best of hands. Scum always rises to the top.

    And Nicholas, it’s not my job to stop slavery worldwide. It’s only my job to keep it from reoccurring in my country.

  • Julie near Chicago

    Laird, just to point out that it’s not your job (assigned to you from on high in some sense or other) to stop its recurrence in your country. It only becomes your job if you accept a position that includes the requirement in its job description (contract).

    According to some variants of libertarian theory, that is.

    Actually, whatever requirement there is in that direction depends on common sense, self-interest properly understood (“long-term” self-interest), and the dictates of one’s own conscience.

    Just sayin’. :>)

  • Laird

    Julie, when I said “my” I was speaking in my alternate persona as Uncle Sam!

    A side issue (but not wholly unrelated): last night I saw the new Oliver Stone movie Snowden. Highly recommended.

  • Fraser Orr

    Yeah, the solution to these ridiculous small scale pirates is a few security guards on the ships. The idea that the navy is needed to deal with a few freelancing thugs is ridiculous and deeply disempowering in the way that governments like to disempower people. It is exactly the same as the idea that people shouldn’t be armed because the police will save them. As they say, when seconds count the US Navy is only minutes away.

    Navies are for fighting other navies not a few wankers in a leaky boat with a couple of guns.

  • Laird

    All true, Fraser, but you do understand the reason for this, right? Most ships don’t have armed defenses because their owners prohibit it, and that is because their insurance companies prohibit it, and that is because international law (treaties, UN pronouncements, etc.) takes a very dim view of any such “self help”. Once again, the problem can be traced directly back to the move toward world government. This is precisely why I support the concept (in Perry’s words) of “a more fragmented multipolar world.”

  • Julie near Chicago

    Laird, I took it that you were speaking of yourself as a representative of Everyman, so not specifically as Laird. But I also wasn’t thinking of you as “Uncle Sam,” whether by that you mean the nation or national polity, or more narrowly as The Gov.

    In any case, I wasn’t trying to play Gotcha! I meant it as showing a way that one (some person somewhere, or lots of people here and there) might find the belief that he ought to help out in this matter, whether by enlisting or financially or simply by moral support, out of his very nature: his conscience, his particular sense of what is right.

    Nothing in libertarian theory prevents that from being a legitimate motive for a libertarian to hold. Of course the reall

    “Just sayin’,” again. :>))

  • PhilB

    @Nicholas (Unlicensed Joker!) Gray – It’s true the Russians want a warm water port but they have Vladivostock if they wanted to interfere with the Chinese. Vladimir Bogdanovitch Rasun (who writes in the west as Victor Suvorov) wrote THIS:


    which describes the Russo-Sino border defences. If you are in the mood, he describes the Spetznaz (Voiskie Spetialnoya Naznachenya – excuse the spelling – I am relying on memory) troops and their role in warfare here:


    As for slavery, the Arabs NEVER gave it up – it just went underground after it was announced that it was illegal in the late 1960’s. On of my friends has a slave collar purchased in Pakistan 5 or so years ago and it is not a novelty for westerners wanting to indulge in a bit 50 Shades of Gray. Why go they make them, eh?

    Hanging pirates when caught or using an M2 Browning to shoot them to bits at long range would be my preferred option but that would give politicians the vapours.