A toilet might make a better point than a drain!

For all the talk about not making rash spending promises or "irresponsible" pledges to cut tax, Michael Howard has bounced the Shadow Cabinet into a massive irresponsible spending commitment in backing the Government's ID card scheme. This must have come as quite a surprise to many MPs and candidates in the 2005 election. With the tendency of the current Conservative leader to make up policy on the fly, it is getting increasingly difficult to remember what this week's policy on anything is. If the billions needed for funding ID cards is really sitting there in departmental budgets waiting to be spent I would rather see the Conservative Party pledge to give it back in tax cuts.

Oh, I think I know where it is going, but it isn't down the drain so much as here!

I somehow think Howards right on this one - the public is not that concerned about the libertarian issue and are more concerned about terrorists and immigration.

Not drain but brain.

The public is brainless then, Giles. The idea ID cards will do a damn thing about terrorism is hilarious... do you have any idea how many countries with ID cards ALSO have endemic terrorism? Schmuck.

Once the public have to start buying and carrying their ID cards, I suspect the mood will turn against them. It'll probably take so long to implement that it might even be a Conservative government that has to manage their introduction too, like an even bigger version of the Dome!

Looks like we are going to have a Labour government for a long while yet! - not that it would make much difference if it was not so...

Howard, writing his opinion [Link] in today's Telegraph, claims that , "I have listened to the police and security service chiefs. They have told me that ID cards can and will help their efforts to protect the lives of British citizens against terrorist acts. How can I disregard that?".

Well they would, wouldn't they? Nobody yet seems to be abl, or willing, to inform British citizens exactly how these measures will protect their lives against terrorism.

Michael Howard is an authoritarian. He is also not much of a success as Tory leader. They are no better in the polls now than they were when IDS was in charge.

So what if the chief securicrats favour an ID card? They probably also want a national DNA database too, and black box recorders in all motor vehicles. That's their mindset, it does not make it right.

Does Howard not have any concept of a cost/benefit analysis? This never seems to be done in the public sector, because the cost is passed on to the drones who pay taxes. If we really need more "security" then there have to be dozens of ways in which £5 billion could bring better results, and in the near future, not 2012. The fact that the slave card cannot be in use in less than 8 years proves it is nothing to do with the current terrorist situation. It is a huge power grab by the state. More fool us if we fall for it.

Only the innocent have anything to fear!

It's probably cheaper to buy everyone a handgun. heh

Even some Labour MPs are voting against this, as are the Lib Dems. The Tories are passing up a perfectly good chance to put the government under real pressure. Some "opposition" that is!

Only 18 Labour MP's voted against the Government but at least they voted. The two-line whip served on the LaboraTory Party essentially told those in opposition to the bill to, "go shopping or go to a restaurant or something, just don't vote against the Government."

A very sad day indeed.

I oppose ID cards because, while I have nothing to hide, I also have nothing to prove.

Stupid Tories.

Fair dinkum, I cannot believe the Tory Party has asuch a complete arse for a leader. If they ever try that garbage down here, there'll be blood in the streets.