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	<title>Comments on: 3D printing won&#8217;t be domesticated any time soon (but then again how it might)</title>
	<atom:link href="http://www.samizdata.net/2012/08/3d-printing-won/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://www.samizdata.net/2012/08/3d-printing-won/</link>
	<description>A blog for people with a critically rational individualist perspective</description>
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		<title>By: ThePresentOccupier</title>
		<link>http://www.samizdata.net/2012/08/3d-printing-won/#comment-237106</link>
		<dc:creator>ThePresentOccupier</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 29 Aug 2012 08:10:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://192.168.200.139/?p=15131#comment-237106</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I&#039;m afraid I remain steadfast in my indifference to domestic 3d printing for the near future.  RepRap, as has been pointed out, is a toy - yes, it can build some of the parts for another RepRap, but as far as producing genuinely useful products in and of itself, it can&#039;t. 

I strongly believe that for at least the next 15 years at least, rapid prototyping will remain out of the home for all but the most dedicated of tinkerers (who are probably in engineering disciplines already).  For the rest, occasional access to a commercial machine *may* be an option, but using the iPad as an example, the vast majority are more content to consume content than create it.

There is an issue I&#039;ve seen raised several times over the use of RP tech in the jewellery field - that of individuals who do not have a grasp on the basic function of jewellery (being wearable, for the most part) creating elaborate designs using wax mills which then result in unusable pieces; without a grasp on the fundamentals of design, this is going to happen wherever &quot;making stuff&quot; has the hard work taken out of it.
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		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;m afraid I remain steadfast in my indifference to domestic 3d printing for the near future.  RepRap, as has been pointed out, is a toy &#8211; yes, it can build some of the parts for another RepRap, but as far as producing genuinely useful products in and of itself, it can&#8217;t. </p>
<p>I strongly believe that for at least the next 15 years at least, rapid prototyping will remain out of the home for all but the most dedicated of tinkerers (who are probably in engineering disciplines already).  For the rest, occasional access to a commercial machine *may* be an option, but using the iPad as an example, the vast majority are more content to consume content than create it.</p>
<p>There is an issue I&#8217;ve seen raised several times over the use of RP tech in the jewellery field &#8211; that of individuals who do not have a grasp on the basic function of jewellery (being wearable, for the most part) creating elaborate designs using wax mills which then result in unusable pieces; without a grasp on the fundamentals of design, this is going to happen wherever &#8220;making stuff&#8221; has the hard work taken out of it.</p>
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		<title>By: MakajazMonkee</title>
		<link>http://www.samizdata.net/2012/08/3d-printing-won/#comment-237105</link>
		<dc:creator>MakajazMonkee</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 27 Aug 2012 07:48:16 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://192.168.200.139/?p=15131#comment-237105</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[&quot;I wouldn&#039;t expect a 3D printer to have an X-ray attachment to check for cracks in printed output anytime soon, for example&quot;

I saw a rough draft of the ASTM standard for laser printed titanium a while back (actually engineers say additive manufacturing), so I think that will come out soon.

If you cast or machine something you don&#039;t X-ray every component for cracks etc. Once a process is running you have to assume you have repeatability. 

&quot;There needs to be a standard format that is easy to print (a sort of PDF for 3D printers) and a way to share them&quot;

The ASTM has developed this its called the additive manufacturing file format, at the moment its .STL, but they say this will kick in soon

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Additive_Manufacturing_File_Format
 ]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;I wouldn&#8217;t expect a 3D printer to have an X-ray attachment to check for cracks in printed output anytime soon, for example&#8221;</p>
<p>I saw a rough draft of the ASTM standard for laser printed titanium a while back (actually engineers say additive manufacturing), so I think that will come out soon.</p>
<p>If you cast or machine something you don&#8217;t X-ray every component for cracks etc. Once a process is running you have to assume you have repeatability. </p>
<p>&#8220;There needs to be a standard format that is easy to print (a sort of PDF for 3D printers) and a way to share them&#8221;</p>
<p>The ASTM has developed this its called the additive manufacturing file format, at the moment its .STL, but they say this will kick in soon</p>
<p><a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Additive_Manufacturing_File_Format" rel="nofollow">http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Additive_Manufacturing_File_Format</a></p>
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		<title>By: 'Nuke' Gray</title>
		<link>http://www.samizdata.net/2012/08/3d-printing-won/#comment-237104</link>
		<dc:creator>'Nuke' Gray</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 27 Aug 2012 01:32:35 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://192.168.200.139/?p=15131#comment-237104</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Of course, we&#039;re talking about homes. If we broadened this to include shops, then you or I might visit our local Prada outlet, see a design we want, be scanned by a machine, and have our taylor-made Prada 3d-printed right there, by a mechanical taylor. Prada would keep the design-parameters within its own computers, and we would still enjoy the fun of shopping.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Of course, we&#8217;re talking about homes. If we broadened this to include shops, then you or I might visit our local Prada outlet, see a design we want, be scanned by a machine, and have our taylor-made Prada 3d-printed right there, by a mechanical taylor. Prada would keep the design-parameters within its own computers, and we would still enjoy the fun of shopping.</p>
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		<title>By: Dave Walker</title>
		<link>http://www.samizdata.net/2012/08/3d-printing-won/#comment-237103</link>
		<dc:creator>Dave Walker</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 26 Aug 2012 18:27:51 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://192.168.200.139/?p=15131#comment-237103</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Thinking some more, there&#039;s a reason to play off the matters of built-in obsolescence and printed parts for Mercedes (surprising post, that) against eachother - warranties and quality assurance.

If I have a blender I bought ages ago which is out of warranty, making a new part to fix it is a win for me, and a little skin off the nose of the vendor for charging too much for spares. However, if I have a Mercedes, fitting a part other than an official Mercedes one could have unfortunate knock-on effects if it isn&#039;t a perfect reproduction of a standard one (I wouldn&#039;t expect a 3D printer to have an X-ray attachment to check for cracks in printed output anytime soon, for example).]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thinking some more, there&#8217;s a reason to play off the matters of built-in obsolescence and printed parts for Mercedes (surprising post, that) against eachother &#8211; warranties and quality assurance.</p>
<p>If I have a blender I bought ages ago which is out of warranty, making a new part to fix it is a win for me, and a little skin off the nose of the vendor for charging too much for spares. However, if I have a Mercedes, fitting a part other than an official Mercedes one could have unfortunate knock-on effects if it isn&#8217;t a perfect reproduction of a standard one (I wouldn&#8217;t expect a 3D printer to have an X-ray attachment to check for cracks in printed output anytime soon, for example).</p>
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		<title>By: Dave Walker</title>
		<link>http://www.samizdata.net/2012/08/3d-printing-won/#comment-237102</link>
		<dc:creator>Dave Walker</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 26 Aug 2012 18:19:05 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://192.168.200.139/?p=15131#comment-237102</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Nice ramble, Mr M - and I&#039;ve enjoyed reading the comments so far, too (especially the point about built-in obsolescence) :-).

Ultimately, 3D printing ends up with Neal Stephenson&#039;s &quot;The Diamond Age&quot; (admittedly, is in the same way that rocketry ends up in the kind of sci-fi Universe where space travel is commonplace, while remaining within the constraint of lightspeed). This may well be where the implicit connection between 3D printing and nanotech is coming from - as well as work on direct atomic manipulation by IBM and others.

I admit I can&#039;t see a need for having a 3D printer myself, yet; I may find one in future. However, I remember when the easiest way to get something photocopied or faxed involved going to a corner shop; I happened to need a flatbed scanner for something a couple of months back, and found that a combined scanner-printer-copier-fax was cheaper at Staples than a standalone scanner. This gives me an opinion that one of the factors which will drive the cost of 3D printing down, is if it becomes a procedural component in some other process, as well as being a process in its own right.
 ]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Nice ramble, Mr M &#8211; and I&#8217;ve enjoyed reading the comments so far, too (especially the point about built-in obsolescence) <img src='http://www.samizdata.net/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':-)' class='wp-smiley' /> .</p>
<p>Ultimately, 3D printing ends up with Neal Stephenson&#8217;s &#8220;The Diamond Age&#8221; (admittedly, is in the same way that rocketry ends up in the kind of sci-fi Universe where space travel is commonplace, while remaining within the constraint of lightspeed). This may well be where the implicit connection between 3D printing and nanotech is coming from &#8211; as well as work on direct atomic manipulation by IBM and others.</p>
<p>I admit I can&#8217;t see a need for having a 3D printer myself, yet; I may find one in future. However, I remember when the easiest way to get something photocopied or faxed involved going to a corner shop; I happened to need a flatbed scanner for something a couple of months back, and found that a combined scanner-printer-copier-fax was cheaper at Staples than a standalone scanner. This gives me an opinion that one of the factors which will drive the cost of 3D printing down, is if it becomes a procedural component in some other process, as well as being a process in its own right.</p>
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		<title>By: Russ</title>
		<link>http://www.samizdata.net/2012/08/3d-printing-won/#comment-237101</link>
		<dc:creator>Russ</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 26 Aug 2012 18:10:40 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://192.168.200.139/?p=15131#comment-237101</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Cost, cost, cost.

I&#039;m not a tech pioneer, but I *do* occasionally need things made that mass-manufacturing won&#039;t provide, and which are cost-prohibitive to go the (otherwise economically-superior) dye/stamp route.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Cost, cost, cost.</p>
<p>I&#8217;m not a tech pioneer, but I *do* occasionally need things made that mass-manufacturing won&#8217;t provide, and which are cost-prohibitive to go the (otherwise economically-superior) dye/stamp route.</p>
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		<title>By: David Bouvier</title>
		<link>http://www.samizdata.net/2012/08/3d-printing-won/#comment-237100</link>
		<dc:creator>David Bouvier</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 25 Aug 2012 09:43:53 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://192.168.200.139/?p=15131#comment-237100</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I would say home-scale 3D printing is current analogous to the home dot-matrix printer. Remeber them?

It took 20+ years for the golfball to be replaced by big expensive lasers, then cheap lasers, then expensive colour lases, then cheap colour lasers.

There is still big differentiation ]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I would say home-scale 3D printing is current analogous to the home dot-matrix printer. Remeber them?</p>
<p>It took 20+ years for the golfball to be replaced by big expensive lasers, then cheap lasers, then expensive colour lases, then cheap colour lasers.</p>
<p>There is still big differentiation </p>
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		<title>By: Dale Amon</title>
		<link>http://www.samizdata.net/2012/08/3d-printing-won/#comment-237099</link>
		<dc:creator>Dale Amon</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 25 Aug 2012 00:17:27 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://192.168.200.139/?p=15131#comment-237099</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I suspect the earliest home units will have a standard feedstack (white plastic precursor) and an app that looks like a catalog. Pick the picture of the thing you want, answer how many you need and hit PRINT.

Of course there would be the option for experts to use autocad or whatever produces the definition file to make their own things, but they would all be white plastic objects. There are a lot of those in your life. 

]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I suspect the earliest home units will have a standard feedstack (white plastic precursor) and an app that looks like a catalog. Pick the picture of the thing you want, answer how many you need and hit PRINT.</p>
<p>Of course there would be the option for experts to use autocad or whatever produces the definition file to make their own things, but they would all be white plastic objects. There are a lot of those in your life. </p>
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		<title>By: TMLutas</title>
		<link>http://www.samizdata.net/2012/08/3d-printing-won/#comment-237098</link>
		<dc:creator>TMLutas</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 24 Aug 2012 21:16:49 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://192.168.200.139/?p=15131#comment-237098</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Here&#039;s your killer app, ending planned obsolescence as we know it. I recall a blender from many years back. It worked fine until a plastic gear stripped. I took the blender apart, identified the defective part, called the manufacturer and was told that the gear, which had perhaps a dime&#039;s worth of plastic, was only sold for $25 and a new blender of the same model could be had for $29. 

A 3D printed part might be more expensive to make, perhaps $1 instead of $0.10, but I would have gotten my blender working again that day and for far less than I ended up spending. Printing parts, especially weak parts that are designed to go easily and early is a good sweet spot for the current state of the art in 3D printers. ]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Here&#8217;s your killer app, ending planned obsolescence as we know it. I recall a blender from many years back. It worked fine until a plastic gear stripped. I took the blender apart, identified the defective part, called the manufacturer and was told that the gear, which had perhaps a dime&#8217;s worth of plastic, was only sold for $25 and a new blender of the same model could be had for $29. </p>
<p>A 3D printed part might be more expensive to make, perhaps $1 instead of $0.10, but I would have gotten my blender working again that day and for far less than I ended up spending. Printing parts, especially weak parts that are designed to go easily and early is a good sweet spot for the current state of the art in 3D printers. </p>
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		<title>By: Jaded Voluntaryist</title>
		<link>http://www.samizdata.net/2012/08/3d-printing-won/#comment-237097</link>
		<dc:creator>Jaded Voluntaryist</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 24 Aug 2012 18:55:13 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://192.168.200.139/?p=15131#comment-237097</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I agree that the applications of 3D printing have been overblown, but I can still think of a lot of things the ability to make things out of ABS plastic that are bigger than a penny but smaller than a football would come in very handy for.

Combined with a 3D scanner I can think of quite a few applications.  Replacement parts for, well, anything that uses plastic parts.  New bath plug.  Fully functional silencer for a .22 - I doubt plastic would be strong enough for a bigger cartridge but it would definitely work for a .22.  Of course it could also be used to create moulds with which to cast things from metal as well.

If I were the government it would be things like the latter 2 I would be worrying about.  These are the areas where 3D printers would make it possible to procure things you&#039;re not supposed to have.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I agree that the applications of 3D printing have been overblown, but I can still think of a lot of things the ability to make things out of ABS plastic that are bigger than a penny but smaller than a football would come in very handy for.</p>
<p>Combined with a 3D scanner I can think of quite a few applications.  Replacement parts for, well, anything that uses plastic parts.  New bath plug.  Fully functional silencer for a .22 &#8211; I doubt plastic would be strong enough for a bigger cartridge but it would definitely work for a .22.  Of course it could also be used to create moulds with which to cast things from metal as well.</p>
<p>If I were the government it would be things like the latter 2 I would be worrying about.  These are the areas where 3D printers would make it possible to procure things you&#8217;re not supposed to have.</p>
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		<title>By: bloke in spain</title>
		<link>http://www.samizdata.net/2012/08/3d-printing-won/#comment-237096</link>
		<dc:creator>bloke in spain</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 24 Aug 2012 18:48:55 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://192.168.200.139/?p=15131#comment-237096</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Sorry, Llamas, what I meant by infinitely scaleable, in this sense would be in the same sense that a 2D printer can scale an image from the lower limit where too few pixels fail to define the image up to the maximum size the printer can handle. And in the same way, change the relationship between the axises, except again there&#039;s three to work in rather than two. What can be done with that? Damned if I know but Photoshop &amp; CAD have given birth to the CGI industry, film SFX, computer games etc.
OK, similar stuff can be achieved with CNC machines etc but only in a limited, expensive way

A quote from a favourite SF author I&#039;ve always liked:

&lt;em&gt;&quot;You know what your trouble is?&quot; he says when we&#8217;re under the bridge, headed up to Fourth. &quot;You&#8217;re the kind who always reads the handbook. Anything people build, any kind of technology, it&#8217;s going to have some specific purpose. It&#8217;s for doing something that somebody already understands. But if it&#8217;s new technology, it&#8217;ll open areas nobody&#8217;s ever thought of before. You read the manual, man, and you won&#8217;t play around with it, not the same way. And you get all funny when somebody else uses it to do something you never thought of.   William  Gibson - The Winter Market &lt;/em&gt;

]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Sorry, Llamas, what I meant by infinitely scaleable, in this sense would be in the same sense that a 2D printer can scale an image from the lower limit where too few pixels fail to define the image up to the maximum size the printer can handle. And in the same way, change the relationship between the axises, except again there&#8217;s three to work in rather than two. What can be done with that? Damned if I know but Photoshop &#038; CAD have given birth to the CGI industry, film SFX, computer games etc.<br />
OK, similar stuff can be achieved with CNC machines etc but only in a limited, expensive way</p>
<p>A quote from a favourite SF author I&#8217;ve always liked:</p>
<p><em>&#8220;You know what your trouble is?&#8221; he says when we&rsquo;re under the bridge, headed up to Fourth. &#8220;You&rsquo;re the kind who always reads the handbook. Anything people build, any kind of technology, it&rsquo;s going to have some specific purpose. It&rsquo;s for doing something that somebody already understands. But if it&rsquo;s new technology, it&rsquo;ll open areas nobody&rsquo;s ever thought of before. You read the manual, man, and you won&rsquo;t play around with it, not the same way. And you get all funny when somebody else uses it to do something you never thought of.   William  Gibson &#8211; The Winter Market </em></p>
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		<title>By: Friday Night Smoke</title>
		<link>http://www.samizdata.net/2012/08/3d-printing-won/#comment-237095</link>
		<dc:creator>Friday Night Smoke</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 24 Aug 2012 18:48:51 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://192.168.200.139/?p=15131#comment-237095</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I think that long before 3d printers appear in homes they will be on street corners, perhaps in the ever-diversifying newsagents as highlighted on your personal blog.
The whole point of a 3d printer is it&#039;s versatility (even when restricted to a specific material). Such machines would be far better utilised (and more cost effective) on a for-hire basis.
I have however thought of a potential application that interests me: I am a forklift dealer by day, and operate independently from any manufacturer, meaning I am called upon to maintain a wide variety of different forklifts. The main bugbear of my life is obtaining parts; at best I can get parts by next day delivery from either a manufacturers&#039; stock or from the now global near monopoly 3rd party parts supplier in Belgium. Often the next day (or later) isn&#039;t quick enough for my customers, who tend to be small operations with one forklift that is absolutely essential to them. I can&#039;t carry a stock of all the parts I might need due to the variety of forklifts I am called upon to repair.
So, if 3d printing gets to the stage where it can economically produce metal parts of reasonable strength cheaply and quickly, I would be likely to have parts produced locally by 3d printing at the time they are required, for one of my engineers to pick up and fit immediately. I&#039;m not talking about heavy-duty load bearing parts, they tend to be quite generic and available within 25 miles at a moment&#039;s notice. I&#039;m talking about things like thermostat housings, handbrake levers and other moderately strong, physically complex parts too specialised to forklifts to be available from a car parts supplier (which are numerous, well stocked and local).
When 3d printing does that, I&#039;ll be a happy man.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think that long before 3d printers appear in homes they will be on street corners, perhaps in the ever-diversifying newsagents as highlighted on your personal blog.<br />
The whole point of a 3d printer is it&#8217;s versatility (even when restricted to a specific material). Such machines would be far better utilised (and more cost effective) on a for-hire basis.<br />
I have however thought of a potential application that interests me: I am a forklift dealer by day, and operate independently from any manufacturer, meaning I am called upon to maintain a wide variety of different forklifts. The main bugbear of my life is obtaining parts; at best I can get parts by next day delivery from either a manufacturers&#8217; stock or from the now global near monopoly 3rd party parts supplier in Belgium. Often the next day (or later) isn&#8217;t quick enough for my customers, who tend to be small operations with one forklift that is absolutely essential to them. I can&#8217;t carry a stock of all the parts I might need due to the variety of forklifts I am called upon to repair.<br />
So, if 3d printing gets to the stage where it can economically produce metal parts of reasonable strength cheaply and quickly, I would be likely to have parts produced locally by 3d printing at the time they are required, for one of my engineers to pick up and fit immediately. I&#8217;m not talking about heavy-duty load bearing parts, they tend to be quite generic and available within 25 miles at a moment&#8217;s notice. I&#8217;m talking about things like thermostat housings, handbrake levers and other moderately strong, physically complex parts too specialised to forklifts to be available from a car parts supplier (which are numerous, well stocked and local).<br />
When 3d printing does that, I&#8217;ll be a happy man.</p>
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