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	<title>Comments on: The curious saga of the Tom Cruise book</title>
	<atom:link href="http://www.samizdata.net/2008/01/the-curious-sag/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://www.samizdata.net/2008/01/the-curious-sag/</link>
	<description>A blog for people with a critically rational individualist perspective</description>
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		<title>By: John</title>
		<link>http://www.samizdata.net/2008/01/the-curious-sag/#comment-158338</link>
		<dc:creator>John</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 19 Jan 2008 03:28:26 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://192.168.200.139/?p=11051#comment-158338</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[As regards the video that RAB refers to at 
&lt;a href=&quot;http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZQXLuWz6OqU&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZQXLuWz6OqU&lt;/a&gt;

... this has been replaced with the following notice:

&lt;blockquote&gt;This video is no longer available due to a copyright claim by Church of Scientology International&lt;/blockquote&gt;

Remember, just because you&#039;re paranoid, it doesn&#039;t meant they&#039;re not out to get you ....
]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>As regards the video that RAB refers to at<br />
<a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZQXLuWz6OqU" rel="nofollow">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZQXLuWz6OqU</a></p>
<p>&#8230; this has been replaced with the following notice:</p>
<blockquote><p>This video is no longer available due to a copyright claim by Church of Scientology International</p></blockquote>
<p>Remember, just because you&#8217;re paranoid, it doesn&#8217;t meant they&#8217;re not out to get you &#8230;.</p>
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		<title>By: mike</title>
		<link>http://www.samizdata.net/2008/01/the-curious-sag/#comment-158337</link>
		<dc:creator>mike</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 18 Jan 2008 14:39:16 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://192.168.200.139/?p=11051#comment-158337</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Having watched the video, what immediately strikes me is that the interviewer&#039;s questions are cut out - so we don&#039;t know what questions Mr Cruise is responding to. I think that is not unimportant to making a judgement.

However, my overriding impression is that the subject being discussed is the idea of moral responsibility. Where does he say the state should be used to force people to live life in the way he approves?

Aside from the &#039;theaton&#039; stuff, I get the sense that people generally ridicule scientologists as crazy &#039;authoritarians&#039; merely because they hold certain propositions to be true whilst refusing to entertain others. For example, on Brooke Shields&#039; use of psychiatry, Cruise was asked by an interviewer whether he thought psychiatry could work for some people - or in other words, he was asked whether he had any doubt about the &#039;evil&#039; of psychiatry. The fact that he answered &#039;no&#039; seems to me not so much evidence that he is an &#039;authoritarian&#039;, but rather that he holds certain propositions about psychiatry to be true - which is to say he has a belief about it. What, if anything, is inherently authoritarian about that?]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Having watched the video, what immediately strikes me is that the interviewer&#8217;s questions are cut out &#8211; so we don&#8217;t know what questions Mr Cruise is responding to. I think that is not unimportant to making a judgement.</p>
<p>However, my overriding impression is that the subject being discussed is the idea of moral responsibility. Where does he say the state should be used to force people to live life in the way he approves?</p>
<p>Aside from the &#8216;theaton&#8217; stuff, I get the sense that people generally ridicule scientologists as crazy &#8216;authoritarians&#8217; merely because they hold certain propositions to be true whilst refusing to entertain others. For example, on Brooke Shields&#8217; use of psychiatry, Cruise was asked by an interviewer whether he thought psychiatry could work for some people &#8211; or in other words, he was asked whether he had any doubt about the &#8216;evil&#8217; of psychiatry. The fact that he answered &#8216;no&#8217; seems to me not so much evidence that he is an &#8216;authoritarian&#8217;, but rather that he holds certain propositions about psychiatry to be true &#8211; which is to say he has a belief about it. What, if anything, is inherently authoritarian about that?</p>
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		<title>By: Daveon</title>
		<link>http://www.samizdata.net/2008/01/the-curious-sag/#comment-158336</link>
		<dc:creator>Daveon</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 17 Jan 2008 22:15:35 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://192.168.200.139/?p=11051#comment-158336</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[&lt;i&gt;Tom Cruise is anything other than a closet authoritarian&lt;/i&gt;

I don&#039;t think that&#039;s a closet he has a problem being out of.

If you catch my drift.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><i>Tom Cruise is anything other than a closet authoritarian</i></p>
<p>I don&#8217;t think that&#8217;s a closet he has a problem being out of.</p>
<p>If you catch my drift.</p>
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		<title>By: Russ Goble</title>
		<link>http://www.samizdata.net/2008/01/the-curious-sag/#comment-158335</link>
		<dc:creator>Russ Goble</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 17 Jan 2008 16:40:16 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://192.168.200.139/?p=11051#comment-158335</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I don&#039;t know, an organization that files a libel lawsuit anyone says anything remotely negative about the organization seems that they are using the rules put in place by the state to very much limit your liberty. There may be a place for libel laws but this church&#039;s use of them is very much not what people intended for them.

Also, if youtube pulls the Tom Cruise video, Gawker has it here and is refusing to pull it despite the threat of the lawsuit. Anyone who thinks it&#039;s benign needs to see this and if you conclude that Tom Cruise is anything other than a closet authoritarian, well, you have a very forgiving outlook on things. The guy (who happens to be the primary bankroller of the church) is a special kind of crazy.

&lt;a href=&quot;http://gawker.com/5002269/the-cruise-indoctrination-video-scientology-tried-to-suppress&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;http://gawker.com/5002269/the-cruise-indoctrination-video-scientology-tried-to-suppress&lt;/a&gt;
]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I don&#8217;t know, an organization that files a libel lawsuit anyone says anything remotely negative about the organization seems that they are using the rules put in place by the state to very much limit your liberty. There may be a place for libel laws but this church&#8217;s use of them is very much not what people intended for them.</p>
<p>Also, if youtube pulls the Tom Cruise video, Gawker has it here and is refusing to pull it despite the threat of the lawsuit. Anyone who thinks it&#8217;s benign needs to see this and if you conclude that Tom Cruise is anything other than a closet authoritarian, well, you have a very forgiving outlook on things. The guy (who happens to be the primary bankroller of the church) is a special kind of crazy.</p>
<p><a href="http://gawker.com/5002269/the-cruise-indoctrination-video-scientology-tried-to-suppress" rel="nofollow">http://gawker.com/5002269/the-cruise-indoctrination-video-scientology-tried-to-suppress</a></p>
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		<title>By: renminbi</title>
		<link>http://www.samizdata.net/2008/01/the-curious-sag/#comment-158334</link>
		<dc:creator>renminbi</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 17 Jan 2008 16:18:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://192.168.200.139/?p=11051#comment-158334</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[   A vile organization. My late first wife went to a recruitment event out of curiosity and asked some questions. A number of these dickheads then turned around and kept glaring at her. Thanks RAB, very funny- well maybe that&#039;s not the word.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>   A vile organization. My late first wife went to a recruitment event out of curiosity and asked some questions. A number of these dickheads then turned around and kept glaring at her. Thanks RAB, very funny- well maybe that&#8217;s not the word.</p>
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		<title>By: Ryan Frank</title>
		<link>http://www.samizdata.net/2008/01/the-curious-sag/#comment-158333</link>
		<dc:creator>Ryan Frank</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 17 Jan 2008 15:51:40 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://192.168.200.139/?p=11051#comment-158333</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Don&#039;t be too sure about the &#039;at least they don&#039;t kill people&#039; part.  True, they don&#039;t go cutting off the heads of the unbelievers, but they have some very nutty views on how to treat drug addictions, and people have died in thier &#039;detox&#039; centers.  Also, not murder, but google &#039;Operation Freak Out&#039; sometime... ]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Don&#8217;t be too sure about the &#8216;at least they don&#8217;t kill people&#8217; part.  True, they don&#8217;t go cutting off the heads of the unbelievers, but they have some very nutty views on how to treat drug addictions, and people have died in thier &#8216;detox&#8217; centers.  Also, not murder, but google &#8216;Operation Freak Out&#8217; sometime&#8230; </p>
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		<title>By: Sunfish</title>
		<link>http://www.samizdata.net/2008/01/the-curious-sag/#comment-158332</link>
		<dc:creator>Sunfish</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 17 Jan 2008 14:19:23 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://192.168.200.139/?p=11051#comment-158332</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[&lt;blockquote&gt;There&#039;s also the more interesting and more general question of grey markets. If it is legal to own the goods in Australia, then should the manufacturer (if, say, bought off, or in an attempt to control prices) be able to enforce conditions of resale preventing it being sold to someone there by a third party?&lt;/blockquote&gt;

In the US, the publisher has nothing to say. There&#039;s actually been litigation on this point and US courts have recognized a concept called the &quot;first sale&quot; doctrine.

Basically, once you buy an item, you own it. If it contains IP, the copyright holder still can&#039;t prevent you from re-selling the book or at least not the one that you actually bought.

As for Australia, I&#039;m painfully ignorant of the laws there but I would suspect that their libel laws allow civil suits or even maybe criminal charges where truth is not a complete defense. That&#039;s a rant for another time, but if the judge can&#039;t tell the plaintiff &quot;Either prove that he&#039;s lying and knew better when he published, or GTFO of my court&quot; then that country has a problem.

Strictly IMHO. I hate to bash Australia. If it weren&#039;t for the gun laws I&#039;d have moved there long ago.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<blockquote><p>There&#8217;s also the more interesting and more general question of grey markets. If it is legal to own the goods in Australia, then should the manufacturer (if, say, bought off, or in an attempt to control prices) be able to enforce conditions of resale preventing it being sold to someone there by a third party?</p></blockquote>
<p>In the US, the publisher has nothing to say. There&#8217;s actually been litigation on this point and US courts have recognized a concept called the &#8220;first sale&#8221; doctrine.</p>
<p>Basically, once you buy an item, you own it. If it contains IP, the copyright holder still can&#8217;t prevent you from re-selling the book or at least not the one that you actually bought.</p>
<p>As for Australia, I&#8217;m painfully ignorant of the laws there but I would suspect that their libel laws allow civil suits or even maybe criminal charges where truth is not a complete defense. That&#8217;s a rant for another time, but if the judge can&#8217;t tell the plaintiff &#8220;Either prove that he&#8217;s lying and knew better when he published, or GTFO of my court&#8221; then that country has a problem.</p>
<p>Strictly IMHO. I hate to bash Australia. If it weren&#8217;t for the gun laws I&#8217;d have moved there long ago.</p>
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		<title>By: RAB</title>
		<link>http://www.samizdata.net/2008/01/the-curious-sag/#comment-158331</link>
		<dc:creator>RAB</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 17 Jan 2008 13:41:05 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://192.168.200.139/?p=11051#comment-158331</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Oh you can bet your boots the distributor has been lent on. Scientology has lawyers and private eyes on  perminent contract.
For those of you who want to know what the fruit loop believes, or just in need of a laugh...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZQXLuWz6OqU]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Oh you can bet your boots the distributor has been lent on. Scientology has lawyers and private eyes on  perminent contract.<br />
For those of you who want to know what the fruit loop believes, or just in need of a laugh&#8230;</p>
<p><span class='embed-youtube' style='text-align:center; display: block;'><iframe class='youtube-player' type='text/html' width='640' height='390' src='http://www.youtube.com/embed/ZQXLuWz6OqU?version=3&#038;rel=1&#038;fs=1&#038;showsearch=0&#038;showinfo=1&#038;iv_load_policy=1&#038;wmode=transparent' frameborder='0'></iframe></span></p>
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		<title>By: Rob Fisher</title>
		<link>http://www.samizdata.net/2008/01/the-curious-sag/#comment-158330</link>
		<dc:creator>Rob Fisher</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 17 Jan 2008 13:29:13 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://192.168.200.139/?p=11051#comment-158330</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Related to &quot;publish and be damned&quot;, from the current issue of &lt;a href=&quot;http://ttapress.com/category/interzone/&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;Interzone&lt;/a&gt;:

&lt;blockquote&gt;Robert Ronson, author of a children&#039;s sf novel called Olympic Mind Games -- set at the 2012 London Olympics -- was sternly told by the Olympics 2012 committee that he wasn&#039;t allowed to use the O-word, nor such protected terms as &#039;London 2012&#039; or even just &#039;2012.&#039;  What&#039;s more, they complained, &#039;there is no such thing as Olympic mind games&#039;.  Ronson ignored this bluster and seems to have got away with it.&lt;/blockquote&gt;]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Related to &#8220;publish and be damned&#8221;, from the current issue of <a href="http://ttapress.com/category/interzone/" rel="nofollow">Interzone</a>:</p>
<blockquote><p>Robert Ronson, author of a children&#8217;s sf novel called Olympic Mind Games &#8212; set at the 2012 London Olympics &#8212; was sternly told by the Olympics 2012 committee that he wasn&#8217;t allowed to use the O-word, nor such protected terms as &#8216;London 2012&#8242; or even just &#8217;2012.&#8217;  What&#8217;s more, they complained, &#8216;there is no such thing as Olympic mind games&#8217;.  Ronson ignored this bluster and seems to have got away with it.</p></blockquote>
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		<title>By: TomG</title>
		<link>http://www.samizdata.net/2008/01/the-curious-sag/#comment-158329</link>
		<dc:creator>TomG</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 17 Jan 2008 12:47:24 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://192.168.200.139/?p=11051#comment-158329</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Quote in yesterday&#039;s AP news (could sum it all up):

&quot;It&#039;s rough and tumble, and it&#039;s wild and woolly and it&#039;s a blast,&quot; he says. &quot;It&#039;s a blast. It really is fun, because ... there is nothing better than ... going out there and fighting the fight and, suddenly you see, things are better.&quot;
&quot;Being a Scientologist, when you drive past an accident, it&#039;s not like anyone else; as you drive past, you know you have to do something about it, because you know you&#039;re the only one that can really help.&quot;
]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Quote in yesterday&#8217;s AP news (could sum it all up):</p>
<p>&#8220;It&#8217;s rough and tumble, and it&#8217;s wild and woolly and it&#8217;s a blast,&#8221; he says. &#8220;It&#8217;s a blast. It really is fun, because &#8230; there is nothing better than &#8230; going out there and fighting the fight and, suddenly you see, things are better.&#8221;<br />
&#8220;Being a Scientologist, when you drive past an accident, it&#8217;s not like anyone else; as you drive past, you know you have to do something about it, because you know you&#8217;re the only one that can really help.&#8221;</p>
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		<title>By: Wind Rider</title>
		<link>http://www.samizdata.net/2008/01/the-curious-sag/#comment-158328</link>
		<dc:creator>Wind Rider</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 17 Jan 2008 12:33:06 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://192.168.200.139/?p=11051#comment-158328</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I seriously doubt that any government had anything directly to do with the decision to limit direct distribution to the US and Canada.

A more believable scenario is that the scientologists made the publisher aware that under the libel laws of countries outside the US and Canada, it would be much easier for the church to bring, and win, an action in court. Something the scientologists would have no hesitation in doing. 

Simply google the term &quot;fair game&quot; in terms of its usage by scientology members - fairly chilling. In fact, it&#039;s rather disturbing to review a compilation of the terms they use, and the underlying meaning and philosophy those phrases represent.

Not very nice people. In some ways, just a different variation of whack job than the run of the mill jihadi, in that they&#039;re so willing to blindly give themselves over to something that, to the outside observer, is quite obviously and seriously flawed.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I seriously doubt that any government had anything directly to do with the decision to limit direct distribution to the US and Canada.</p>
<p>A more believable scenario is that the scientologists made the publisher aware that under the libel laws of countries outside the US and Canada, it would be much easier for the church to bring, and win, an action in court. Something the scientologists would have no hesitation in doing. </p>
<p>Simply google the term &#8220;fair game&#8221; in terms of its usage by scientology members &#8211; fairly chilling. In fact, it&#8217;s rather disturbing to review a compilation of the terms they use, and the underlying meaning and philosophy those phrases represent.</p>
<p>Not very nice people. In some ways, just a different variation of whack job than the run of the mill jihadi, in that they&#8217;re so willing to blindly give themselves over to something that, to the outside observer, is quite obviously and seriously flawed.</p>
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		<title>By: Alan Furman</title>
		<link>http://www.samizdata.net/2008/01/the-curious-sag/#comment-158327</link>
		<dc:creator>Alan Furman</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 17 Jan 2008 10:17:40 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://192.168.200.139/?p=11051#comment-158327</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[The definitive source of honest information on the Scientology cult is:

&lt;a target=&quot;_blank&quot; href=&quot;http://xenu.net&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;http://xenu.net(Link)&lt;/a&gt;

]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The definitive source of honest information on the Scientology cult is:</p>
<p><a target="_blank" href="http://xenu.net" rel="nofollow">http://xenu.net(Link)</a></p>
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