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Boche or Blighty?

Who would not sympathise with injured soldiers, forced to endure poor conditions and MRSA at Selly Oak Hospital in Birmingham. Now one has been threatened by a local Muslim:

On one occasion a member of the Parachute Regiment, still dressed in his combat uniform after being evacuated from Afghanistan, was accosted by a Muslim over the British involvement in the country.

Soldiers are concerned about their safety. In such matters, one expects the usual response from government: a statement that refuses to acknowledge the problem and masks neglect:

The Ministry of Defence, which said that it had no record of threatening incidents, indicated that there was a military security presence at the hospital and it co-operated closely with local police.

A MoD spokesman said there was “appropriate security” at Selly Oak for the 11 servicemen currently being treated.

We know where they would like to end up:

Soldiers on operations say they would rather receive a more serious injury and go to the top American military hospital in Ramstein, Germany, than end up in a NHS hospital.

They now half jokingly refer to getting “a Boche rather than a Blighty” in reference to the wounds that would send them home. Ramstein has an outstanding unit for brain surgery, and neurological intensive care beds in Britain are in short supply. “The blokes see it that if you are unlucky you get wounded and go to the UK at the mercy of the NHS, but if you get a head wound you get sent to Ramstein in Germany where the US has an outstanding medical facility,” said an officer serving in Afghanistan.

“It also does not do morale much good knowing that within 18 hours of being wounded you could wake up in a NHS hospital with a mental health patient on one side and an incontinent geriatric on the other.”

The black humour of the British Tommy! No wonder New Labour hates them.

33 comments to Boche or Blighty?

  • Omri

    Is there anyone left in Britain who is still relieved to hear Whitehall has “no record” of an incident?

  • “It also does not do morale much good knowing that within 18 hours of being wounded you could wake up in a NHS hospital with a mental health patient on one side and an incontinent geriatric on the other.”

    As a voter I understand – One is “New Labour” and the other is “Conservative”.

    As for being “accosted” – how about applying all those new regulations and “measures” against violence in hospitals? Oh, sorry, forgot. Those rules apply to everyone else.

  • guy herbert

    Does “accosted” mean the same as “threatened”?

    On the one occaision I can recall being accosted by a British soldier, I was quite unnecessarily (and absurdly) threatened by him after I had given the directions he was seeking. But I don’t think of any other occasion where buttonholing has been accompanied by threats, as opposed to mere disagreement.

  • kcbiskit

    Mr. Herbert,

    Oh, how dreadful. I’m glad you weren’t injured by the brute. You might have ended up in one of those nasty NHS places.

  • Julian Taylor

    Selly Oak Royal Centre for Defence Medicine isn’t exactly one of the NHS disaster zones. The RCDM is pretty much a separate unit from the rest of the establishment, with its own complement of medical staff. its own A&E, long-stay wards and tri-service personnel. It just happens to share its intensive care burns, plastics and gun wounds treatment centre with the rest of the hospital since they probably get better gunshot training in Birmingham than anywhere else in the UK, except maybe Nottingham.

  • guy herbert

    Or Mosside.

  • Robert

    ‘Scuse me, a Para was accosted by a muslim, and the next days headlines totally fail to read “Parts of unidentifiable muslim found scattered over large area of Birmingham”
    What’s that about then?

  • Nick M

    If the report of the muslim slagging-off a wounded paratrooper is true (and it sounds par for the course) then it speaks volumes about how many UK muslims feel about their (our) country.

    There is a video over at LGF of a pro-Hizbollah rally in Brooklyn. Total screeching moonbats. They were going on about “supporting our troops” – the Hizb…

    Both incidents are indicitive of the abysmal cowardice of these people. If they really feel that strongly about it why don’t they hop on a plane to the Mid-East, get an AK-47 and join the jihad.?

    Nah… It’s easier to rant and rave over in the comfy West, insult a wounded soldier (I wonder if this character would have said the same to a fully-fit Para?), call for the death of cartoonists, ask for the crucifiction of a 79 year old pacifist etc.

    Ad nauseum.

    Somewhat OT.

    Listening to Jeremy Vine on R2. I just heard some guy state that the average UK household pays £600,000 in tax over the course of an average lifetime. Think of the private health care you could get for just a fraction of that. Wow!

  • ian

    I went to a community meeting a while ago in a town which has a high military presence. Among those attending were sixth formers from the local school. Without exception the females in that group said that they were wary of going into town on an evening because they were likely to get accosted by drunken squaddies – an in the case of 17 year old girls we know exactly what accosted means.

    Regardless of their performance in places like Afganistan and Iraq over the years, the off duty British soldier does not have a good reputation – which makes it even more surprising that the Muslim who harangued the Para lived to tell the tale…

  • Nick M

    I’ve kept on listening to Vine on R2.

    They just had a caller talking about her son who had been medevaced to Selly Oak. She flew to see him (didn’t say where from) but it was a few days after he arrived. She said his body armour and helmet was still on the floor next to his bed. WTF!

  • Brian

    Please forgive this American reader for asking, but what is the distinction between Boche and Blighty? Thanks.

  • kcbiskit

    Dear Ian,

    How utterly shocking that young men, away from home, with money in their pocket would dare to approach the local young women. This is outrageous and unprecedented. Perhaps some sort of sensitivity training should be enforced.

  • Nick M

    “Boche” = German. (Germany in this context).

    “Blighty” = UK

    In WWI “getting a Blighty” meant sustaining a wound serious enough for repatriation.

  • Nick M

    ian,

    The muslim who harangued the Para, harangued a seriously wounded man. How precisely could he have responded violently?

    I have exactly no idea what in the case of 17 year old girls we know exactly what accosted means refers to.

    I have frequently seen groups of lads who obviously weren’t military behaving in a beastly manner in our town centres. I had a night out in Chesterfield (which isn’t a barracks town) about a decade ago and it was Sodom and Gomarrah roled into one – with added fighting, puking and public urination. Including by women who continued chatting men up whilst micturating – “Lads – come here and see a real treat me mate’s having a piss”. H. Bosch had nothing on the scene outside the Pink Panther bar. And to add a truly surreal tone to the proceedings there was an all pervading smell of Liquorice Allsorts from the Bassetts factory.

    I know a number of guys in the services and they are all perfect gents. You know, training, discipline, the prospect of a spell in the glasshouse at Colchester and a dishonourable discharge. I think you’re merely spouting a stereotype.

    The only time I ever saw a bunch of soldiers nearly get into a ruck was when 3 Royal Marines I was out with almost clobbered some twat who had kicked over a derelict’s beggar bowl in Newcastle and ran about laughing.

    I’m not saying squaddies are angels but I really don’t think they are noticeably worse than any other collection of young men on the razz. Apart from footballers, obviously. Those paragons of sobriety and moral rectitude.

  • Julian Taylor

    I went to a community meeting a while ago in a town which has a high military presence.

    Presumably this is going to be Aldershot or environs, Catterick or one of the other basetowns. Having been stationed in many of these godforsaken places (St John’s Wood still gets my preference) I can tell you from experience that we would always instruct our men not to touch the local ‘talent’ but to find a nice lass away from the hordes of 17 year old fishwives, who seem to pride themselves not only on how many troopers they could shag in a night but give each other extra points for rank and regiment.

    Royal Marines used to have a system called ‘anti-trapping’ where they would go round all the local pubs and bars and stop their mates from ending up with these predators, which usually ending up with the lads all going out together and getting completely plastered anyway.

  • John K

    Apart from footballers, obviously. Those paragons of sobriety and moral rectitude.

    Who also tend to drive Hummers, strangely enough.

  • ian

    Nick M

    I’m not spouting stereotypes but reporting directly from experience – and if you can’t work out the sort of abuse 17 year old schoolgirls are likely to get from drunken males – in or out of uniform – then you have obviously had a very sheltered life.

    (You aren’t Verity under another name are you? – you seem to have the same talent for arguing with those who agree with you)

  • Forgive my ignorance, but aren’t 17 year old women in Britain old enough to drink beer, smoke a fag, and shag as an adult without landing a chap in the clink for statutory?

  • So ian, since you are speaking “from personal experience”, are we to assume that you were once either accosted as a 17 year old school girl, or once accosted one?

    In my time in the military, had my share of sodden eves, but never ran into a case of a girl getting abused or raped. Of course, I was in that sheltered service, the USAF, where we had coed dorms…

  • Fraser

    are we to assume that you were once either accosted as a 17 year old school girl, or once accosted one?

    hahaha. 😉

    Forgive my ignorance, but aren’t 17 year old women in Britain old enough to drink beer, smoke a fag, and shag as an adult without landing a chap in the clink for statutory?

    Mike, you’re more-or-less right. 17 year-olds can’t buy beer in the UK though. They can, however, smoke or have sex. But if their suitor takes videos of them having sex, he is breaking the law.

    Don’t you just love the rational nature of the law.

  • Regardless of their performance in places like Afganistan and Iraq over the years, the off duty British soldier does not have a good reputation – which makes it even more surprising that the Muslim who harangued the Para lived to tell the tale…

    It’s Tommy this, and Tommy that…

  • Steph

    and chuck him out the brute,
    but its the savior of his country
    when the guns begin to shoot.

  • Steph

    and chuck him out the brute,
    but its the savior of his country
    when the guns begin to shoot.

  • The myth of the incorrigible off-duty-soldier is one told far and wide by many a leftie, be it a holllywood movie director leftie, a New York novelist or reporter leftie, or the plain vanilla, run of the mill, long haired cowardly cut and run viciously jealous girlyman who are all actually transferring their own latent repressed hate of their mother upon the lucky bloke in uniform who shags “his” girl….

  • Nick M

    For the record:

    I am not Verity in disguise.

    Anybody who’s been around here might remember I had some vicious clashes with the dragonlady. Although more than likely those memories are blotted out by ones of their own vicious clashes with her…

    (Are you Verity in disguise? sounds like a footie chant.)

    Anybody who thinks the average UK 17 year old girl can’t buy beer is being somewhat naive.

    I was once offerred a blow-job and a fiver by a 14(ish) year old who wanted me to buy her and her mates a half-bottle of “voddy” at a shop which had refused her service.

    I steered well clear. Well clear.

    Britain is well stocked with slags.

  • ian

    Mike Lorrey – you are clearly a genius and beyond my capacity to deal with. Having construed all this from a single sentence, if I give you a paragraph will I get a full Freudian analysis?

    Nick M

    The availability or otherwise of slags in the UK – which I don’t dispute – is not really the issue though is it? All I said was that the British soldier does not have a good reputation off duty. I’m not resorting to stereotypes – I’ve seen it. That however was a passing comment and has nothing to do with the acceptability or otherwise of a severely wounded soldier being harangued by a Muslim over his service in Afghanistan (for the avoidance of doubt – it isn’t).

    Rereading the Telegraph article, some things don’t gel however. Why is this soldier still in his uniform if he has been severely wounded to the extent that he would be unable to defend himself? I assume he has had some treatment before arriving in Birmingham.

    The fact that a Muslim can walk onto a ward in Birmingham without being challenged is not really unusual or unacceptable either. There are after all one or two Muslims in that city, some of whom must get ill and require hospital treatment.

  • Nick M

    ian,

    You have the right to make passing comments. So do I. That’s what I was doing wrt slags.

    Well, I posted somewhere here about something I heard on the Jeremy Vine show on R2 yesterday. When the mother of a wounded squaddie visited her son at Selly Oak hospital some days after his arrival there she said his body armour and helmet were on the floor next to his bed. I heard it in her own words and see no reason why she would lie. Conclusion: this guy who was insulted was with his uniform is entirely plausible.

    The off duty reputation of soldiers isn’t good. But it’s a reputation. A myth that probably goes back to the Napoleanoic wars. Students don’t have a good reputation when out on the lash, stag and hen does don’t have a good reputation, football fans… It’s got sod all to do with being in the military. It’s just a mix of youth, exuberance and alcohol. There is quite a fine line between high spirits and affray and most people know where it is. Some don’t and that has nothing to do with whether they’re in the army or not.

    furthermore, all the servicemen I’ve met have given the distinct impression that crossing that line was severely frowned upon by their COs.

    Your last paragraph is fatuous. The real disgrace here is that because of the actions of some morons we’re even having to consider security for our wounded soldiers within the UK.

  • ian

    From the Telegraph report (my emphasis):

    On one occasion a member of the Parachute Regiment, still dressed in his combat uniform after being evacuated from Afghanistan, was accosted by a Muslim over the British involvement in the country.

    ie not beside the bed.

    A relative of the Para said the [Muslim] man had twice walked on to the ward where two other soldiers and four civilians were being treated without once being challenged by staff.

    ie it is entirely possible the Muslim concerned was visiting someone else and seized the opportunity rather than for the purpose of haranguing this injured man. The fact that he is Muslim should not of itself be enough to demand to know why he is in the hospital. Given his behaviour there is now I believe good reason to exclude him from any ward with military personnel.

    Another passing comment – the Shadow Defence Secretary is calling for injured personnel to be treated on closed wards. Is that really a good idea?

  • Freeman

    I was once involved with a company that had a contract with the Home Office to run a UK prison under Private Finance Initiative (PFI) arrangements — otherwise known as off-balance sheet accounting.
    The point is that the company was, amazingly to me, required to provide all the inmates with private medical insurance. Perhaps the government should do the same for its armed forces and anyone invalided out.

  • Nick M

    ian,

    The question of whether the uniform was beside the bed is beside the point.

    What I was doing was pointing out that it might have been and that the Telegraph might just have reported this small detail inaccurately.

    You seem to be responding to me totally tangentially. Quite why the muslim happened to be there is completely irrelevant. How he (allegedly) behaved is the point.

    Your last paragraph does raise an interesting issue. I have no idea whether it is or it isn’t. It should be an operational decision of the RAMC or something.

    What I do know for certain mind is that if they treated them on closed wards then the Stop the War mob would automatically assume this was a ruse to hide the true extent of our casualties.

    Freeman,
    Interesting idea. I guess a perk like that might help recruitment.

  • Paul Marks

    A lot of people support the N.H.S. by saying “in America they check to see if you have medical cover and if you do not they……..”

    Well they take you to (at worst) a county hospital – a government hospital no worse than the N.H.S.

  • I’m interested to see that this group of libertarians seems to think that there should be special hospital protections, security, and quality for government employees.

    How is sheltering the enforcers of the state’s powers from the ordinary subjects’ difficulties a reasonable thing to do?

    Because I suspect that mediocre care and accosting are not terribly rare events in most NHS establishments.

  • Paul Marks

    Birmingham is fast becoming what is called a “majority minority city” in that the majority of people there are (or soon will be) nonwhite.

    This has been true for some American cities (such as Birmingham Alabama) for many years – however, there are many people still alive who can remember (whatever they are told by the powers that be) when there were virtually no nonwhite people in Birmingham England.

    Contrary to the demands of some racialists nothing much can be done about this now – people born in England have every right to be in England (regardless of the colour of their skin or their religion). But one reason there is still a lot of anger is that for DECADES anyone who said that cities like Birmingham would have a nonwhite majority was called (by the media, government and so on) “paranoid”, “mad”, “dishonest” and so on.

    Religion does complicate things. The nonwhite people in Birmingham happen to be mostly Muslims from (again mostly) from the subcontinent). And Islam and Christianity have been in conflict (on and off) since the 7th century A.D. – indeed the very flag of England (the red cross) is a crusader flag.

    Contrary to what is taught, Islam is not a peacefull religion and Mohammed was not a good man (he was a rapist, a murderer and a plunderer). So long term relations between “the communities” in cities like Birmingham England are likely to be worse than relations between blacks and whites in cities like Birmingham Alabama.

    Again nothing can be done about this (no amount of “community work” is going to solve the problem) it is just something we are going to have to try and live with. There may indeed be long periods of fairly peaceful coexistance between periods of violent conflict.